Thanks for taking part in “Naughty or Nice?” Your responses were generally perceptive, occasionally controversial, always interesting. Some were naughty. Some were nice.
Having read them all this morning I found one strain to them that was absolutely correct and compelling: “… even though some people deserve the coal and not the candy, … in keeping with the civility theme, we should stick to the candy part” – “I thought Unity08 would be a forum for moving forward…” – “So why not just leave it at Nice and leave out the Naughty?”
You are right. We were wrong. We can’t stop the bickering if we are throwing coal. So we aren’t going to do it. Thank you for correcting us.
Now vote and tell us who should get the candy!
Tell your friends about Unity08 and encourage them to vote too!
Because of a tie for fifth place, you have eight names to choose from. If you wish, you can check the blog to see why each was nominated. Remember, this is not a popularity contest. It is to reward those who have been “the most willing to reach across the aisle and cast votes based on what his or her constituents want, not what the special interests buy.”
Doug Bailey is a member of the Unity08 Founders Council.
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I'm very disappointed in Unity08. I thought this might be a breath of fresh air. But when I look at the "nice" poll, I see people like Russ Feingold and Barack Obama leading. Senator Feingold has taken partisan actions like censuring the President. And Senator Obama has no track record.
I am going to think about my future association with Unity08, which seems to be misnamed.
I certainly respect your right to come or go, but before you do think about this. I know Obama is inexperienced but look at the mess we are in thanks to the leaders with a track record. If you do opt out of this movement good luck to you, that is what a representative democracy is all about, freedom of choice.
A Sooner Independent
you may wish rethink being an independent as you give up your opportunity to influence the primarys. Independents are great for being non-committal and able to look at all candidates but the party elects the nominee and that is where we need to have more influence. As an independent, I say pick a party and take part in the nominee of your choice. That is the only way we can get qualified people elected.
> "Senator Feingold has taken partisan actions like censuring the President."
Please explain why you believe it to be a partisan act (if you can).
Since you never read his statement, I linked a copy of it for you to read for the first time.
http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/releases/06/03/20060312.html
If you don't want to read, you can watch it here...
Or if you prefer, you can watch Senator Feingold take on your heroes at Fox News...
> "I am going to think about my future association with Unity08, which seems to be misnamed."
There's a spring on the door which you will pass on the way out, don't let it hit your backside.
The links you provided on Russ Feingold were very helpful. I vote a person's character, not party. While no one has a good character day every day, the video links portray some partisan grandstanding. Maybe in real life he is more Unity08 material, but these links don't show it. He comes off being very petty. I'm concerned about the wiretapping issue also, but it is true that Congress got an opportunity long beforehand, to nix it. They didn't. So for him to use such inflammatory rhetoric against the President, is not acceptable. I didn't believe in the rhetoric against Clinton, either: same problem. Politics lead to heated tempers, and being on live TV of couse results in folks saying things they'd otherwise wish they hadn't said. Unity08 is not about that stuff. If we want unity, we shouldn't vote for the heated rhetoric.
> "I vote a person's character, not party. While no one has a good character day every day, the video links portray some partisan grandstanding."
True... he grandstanded for the Constitution, rule of law, and witdrawing from Iraq. How partisan of him.
> "Maybe in real life he is more Unity08 material, but these links don't show it."
What is "Unity08 material"... mavericks like John McCain and Joe Lieberman?
> "I'm concerned about the wiretapping issue also, but it is true that Congress got an opportunity long beforehand, to nix it. They didn't."
So in your mind it was his fault that the rubber stamp Republican congress did nothing? Bad Russ!
> "So for him to use such inflammatory rhetoric against the President, is not acceptable."
Actually... I prefer the "inflammatory rhetoric" used by Jim Webb.
> "Politics lead to heated tempers, and being on live TV of couse results in folks saying things they'd otherwise wish they hadn't said.
Like George Bush having to answer questions by David Gregory or British journalists, or Dick Cheney to Senator Leahy in congress?
> "Unity08 is not about that stuff. If we want unity, we shouldn't vote for the heated rhetoric."
Oooohhh?
What kind of rhetoric do you prefer... unpassioned?
R8dmarshall:
A heated argument, or heated presentation infers emotive in both instances. They ususally tend to inflame the opposition and cause an exchange of personal attacks, rather than encouraging one to see the other's point.
An impassioned dissertation normally lacks the emotive factor, thus having a more favourable impression on the apposition. It tends to show the respect toward the one you are trying to convence.
Any discoures between humans can move from the positive to the negative or vise versa. If both parties maintain respect for the person spoken to they show respect and have a positive chance for comming to a mutual conclusion; the most important thing is not for one,or the other to win, but for positive progress be made on the subject of the discussion.
As I am very strongly against negative discussions I have much conviction of that opinion. My reason in not throwing stones to force my position is that I am strongly focused on the point of issue. Individual aspects of the person I am addressing is secondary to the issue. Whether one likes the other is not at issue.
Only the search for an answers is the object.
If one argues about a subject he has already lost and it is senceless to continue the intercourse.
R8dmarshall:
Mc Cain and Leibermen have stood against some parts of their parties dogma. Does that make them independant thinkers, or sheep.
In my opinion I tend toward thinking that one who has the conviction to stand alone in their party on specific possions are just the type I would choose. I do not want a person without their own convictions and the strength to stand up for them. I call that a potential leader.
I for one would vote for a ticket with the two of them running together.
I totally agree!! They both demomstrate true political courage (the ability to have the courage of their convictions to tick off their core constituencies many times and stand their ground) as do a host on and just off the political scene that I see - Chuck Hagel, Lindsey Graham, Bob Kerrey, Jim Webb, Sam Nunn, Ben Nelson, Warren Rudman, Jim Baker, Rudy Guiliani, and a few sporadic Governors). They are the Not Pander Bears!! Vote out the Pander Bears that tell us what we want to hear and want to slough off the tough, hard choices on the BIG issues. That is the winning formula!!
Grandstanding? He was defending the Constitution. If that's too wild and radical and nutty for you, I'm at a complete loss...
========
Jim Cook
Irregular Times
http://irregulartimes.com
Of course Barack Obama has a track record. You just have to look for it.
Here's his track record for the 109th Congress:
http://irregularnews.com/senate/senObamaIL.html
And you should also know that he was a state senator in Illinois before he went into national government. Here's a partial track record in the State Senate:
http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/legisnet91/sponsor/OBAMA.html
Of course Barack Obama has a track record. Please.
========
Jim Cook
Irregular Times
http://irregulartimes.com
I have just joined Unity '08 so I can get involved in the discussions.
I'm glad you chose to recognise only the "nice" candidates in your poll. A big time-saver would be appreciated in future similar polls if you would link the names to the information about how and why the names were selected instead of having to search through the blog.
A note about Sen Obama: Everything I have seen and heard so far made me want to vote for him, but I didn't for the same reason as others: he needs more time to establish a record. P.S. Are there really no women in Congress who qualify on this poll??
In Harmony
Aquarius
Here is Senator Feingold on Meet the Press with Tim Russert, talking about Iraq, the US Constitution, and other issues.
He sounds infinitely more intelligent, informed, fair and honest than the guy who is there now.
Hear, hear, Ed! The man says he doesn't want to run for president -- so let's draft him!
Draft Russ Feingold for President!
========
Jim Cook
Irregular Times
http://irregulartimes.com
He won't run for president, but he is deserving of accolades for his tireless work for We The People... so let's give him his due.
I'm hoping that he will be picked as either the VP of a candidate, or the AG of the winner.
Senator Ted Kennedy - For offering up legislation to stop the madness in Iraq and Iran.
John Edwards - For calling for legislation to defund the deadly quagmire in Iraq.
Bernie Sanders - For being the Independent who is NOT a war monger nor a sellout to the voters of his state, as opposed to the other Independent who IS a war monger and a sellout to the voters of his state.
TED KENNEDY lacked the moral fiber to face his own errors in judgment - HOW DARE HE PRESUME TO CRITICIZE ANYBODY AND THINK HE SPEAKS FOR AMERICA - HIS BROTHER JACK MUST BE TURNING OVER IN HIS GRAVE ..
And you "Opinionated Ed" - you have a right to your opinion, but if you can't back it up with more than using other peoples stand on things, your opinions will alway be part of the problem - and never contribute to a solution ..
Click on www.popopete.com read/digest the content of my Posting on The New Strategy, if you can offer real and constructive criticism - and a better alternative with appropriate supporting evidence, I will not only listen - I will offer my support !!
Citizen Evans of Boynton Beach, Florida
I'm easy to find - I'm in the book
It sounds like Ted Kennedy and Newt Gingrich have a lot in common. Maybe that's the ticket we're looking for!
Chuck and Joe have been alienated from their respective parties and sufficiently demonstrated true political courage (in ticking off their constituencies) and smarts to be eligible for a ticket I could support. True Centrists who would be for what works. And if things break the activist way in both parties in early '08 primaries/caucuses as they have inthe past, a Hagel-Lieberman ticket may be palatable to us,them, and the nation!
The Democrats right now are desperately seeking one one Republican Senator to leave the party and join their ranks as an Independent. Right now the ultra-hawk Joe LiebeRman is the swing vote, and is preventing the Dems from taking any real action against Bush's destructive quagmire.
If one Republican crosses over, the Dems will tell Holy Joe to go fornicate himself, and you will then see swift action taken against this godforsaken escalation. There are a number of targets for the Dems to go after, and Chuck Hagel is one of them. Unity08 may be interested in one of the 11, but not Escalation Joe.
Republicans Against the Surge:
Sam Brownback (Kansas)
Norman Coleman (Minnesota)
Susan Collins (Maine)
Chuck Hagel (Nebraska)
Arlan Specter (Pennsylvania)
Gordon Smith (Oregon)
Olympia Snowe (Maine)
George Voinivich (Ohio)
Republicans Skeptical of the Surge:
Richard Lugar (Indiana)
John Sununu (New Hampshire)
John Warner (Virginia)
Democrats for the Surge:
none
Independents for the Surge:
Joe Lieberman
... but I was impressed with the lead he took an the anti-escalation legislation. Unfortunately Harry "Wet Noodle" Reid caved in to Joe "War Hawk" Lieberman, and it was DOA in the senate.
Well PooPooPete, you lived up to your name. You failed to acknowledge what I gave Senator Kennedy credit for, but instead dug up the long ago past and his dead brother. Thank you for allowing me to state my opinion, which was formed from an actual event that took place. But since you lack the awareness that it did happen and are not clued in, I'll spoon feed a link to you:
Escalation? It's Not His Decision to Make
And to top that, Senator Kennedy will propose additional legislation on Health Care:
Sen. Kennedy seeks Universal Health Care plan
Now you strike me as the kind of person who watches Fox News, then mimicks Sean Hannity in lashing out at others who mention a topic you don't like without bothering to read what has been written. If you disagree, then prove me wrong. Read what I wrote in my original post, read what I had written here, then try responding to what I wrote with facts and on topic opinions of your own. Then we can proceed with a rational discussion.
Ed. you like to snipe at people - but you don't offer anything constructive of your own, I put my own feelings out there looking for better ideas I can support - nobody, including Ted Kennedy has offered a Solid Plan With Solid Supporting Commentary !!
Mine is on my blog - I don't see yours anywhere.
As for my feelings about Ted Kennedy - It's not just that he left the scene of a crime, his failure to act responsibly in critical situations - is a matter of record : in recent years he refused to sign a Bill to Protect Our Children - holding them hostage for two years because he wanted his way on an unrelated matter. During that time in my State alone - 4 Children including 1 fatality may have been avoided if the Bill had passed on time. Nothing he does now will make up for that - with me.
You say I shoot from the hip : Obviously you haven't done your homework on me : who I am and what I'm all about - warts and all, is presented in plain language on my Blog www.popopete.com, it will take some effort on your part to get inside my head and my heart - but it's all there, Just Keep Scrolling Back To September 2024 !!
And if you want to dialog with me - please keep it on core issues and any ideas and solutions you have to make things better for all of us.
popo
Pete - I've read your blog, and you are a few cans short of a six pack. Here are some gems...
>>> "Is it really that so many people on both side of the aisle Don’t Get It - or is positioning for the Elections of 2024 so damn important that it takes precedence over winning the peace in the Middle East ??!!"
50 of the Senators get it... it's just that they can only achieve a tie, and VP Cheney will break it against them. Joe LiebeRman has agreed to caucus with the Dems, but will only do so as long as there is no serious opposition to the war. Refer to my post elsewhere here regarding their efforts to cross over another Republican.
>>> "It should be obvious to anyone with half a brain, the new strategy is to win the peace so the Iraqis themselves can win the war - and hopefully set the stage for building peace in the whole Middle East .. if it pleasures you to call this Bush’s war - you need help."
This is the Bush Misadministration's war. Most Americans don't want to be there, and most Iraqis don't want us occupying their country. The Iraqis are standing up... by joining militias against the US. The civil war is not Shi'ite vs Sunni, it goes deeper than that. It is the smaller factions within those religions that are fighting with each other. The simplist dividing line I can offer you is the nationalists (Shi'ite & Sunni) that oppose the US occupation vs the autonomists (Shi'ite & Sunni) that want to help the US break the nation apart to make it easier to grab the country's oil wealth.
The rest shows you to be nothing more than a simpleton who gets his information from Fox News, but occasioanally gets brave and ventures over to CNN for a variety. Enough said, so let's let the other readers venture over to your site and make their own opinions. If you want to get my opinions on the issues, I've published a few diaries at dKos, and have left hundreds of comments there.
Ed, I told you - you are a natural born sniper : and you are the victim of your own negativity ..
And you still haven't offered me anything positive that you created and stuck your neck out to offer for the good of others ..
If you really do check all my postings back to Sept 2024, you may find my postings precede many of the offerings on point from : CSPAN, NBC, ABC, FOX and others !! of course that wouldn't be good enough for you !!
I'll give you one last reminder of my final comment to you : If you want to dialog with me in the future - keep to the core issues and any ideas and solutions you may have to help us all - OTHERWISE PICK UP YOUR MARBLES and go play with somebody more your size and intellect !!
Have a good life - I have and will continue to do so.
OH and by the way, During my 60 years in business, I lived in a number of diferent Countries, in Europe, the Middle East, I lived in both North & South Africa, I dealt with Lebanon, Jordan, Israel, Libya, Greece, Turkey, Spain, Portugal, India, etc : where did you get your expertise on people, places and things - I'd really like to know.
popo
>>> "Ed, I told you - you are a natural born sniper: and you are the victim of your own negativity..."
Yes, I target the Bush 11 percenters that still cluelessly support his quagmire.
>>> "And you still haven't offered me anything positive that you created and stuck your neck out to offer for the good of others..."
Did you bother to go to the site I mentioned?
>>> "If you really do check all my postings back to Sept 2024, you may find my postings precede many of the offerings on point from: CSPAN, NBC, ABC, FOX and others!! of course that wouldn't be good enough for you!!"
Are you saying that you coined catch phrases like "cut and run"?
Be specific, and provide examples.
>>> "I'll give you one last reminder of my final comment to you: If you want to dialog with me in the future - keep to the core issues and any ideas and solutions you may have to help us all - OTHERWISE PICK UP YOUR MARBLES and go play with somebody more your size and intellect !!"
My pet cat would give me a better debate, you rank about even with my goldfish.
R8dmarshall
One's opinion on an issue can be part of the solution, or part of the problem. When it is posted in the negative frame it is part of the problem. The mean spirited mind set attacks individuals ,not problems. Good suggestions and dialog is the purpose of this website.
Anyone who wants to argue here is in the wrong site. Discussion is the free flow of thoughts and opinion for solving problems, not aggrivation and emotive statements.
I agree that mean spirited doesn't help, nor does arguing. There must be an arbiter of the chosen direction, and the only way to do this is by voting. I support the majority opinion no matter how much I have other feelings.
Problem is, we don't know the majority opinion yet. And if the people supporting unity will simply go away if unity doesn't end up supporting 100% of their positions, does that mean we are the basis of the partisanship we see in D.C.?
The "Moderate Middle" has a position on the issues, but any individual in the moderate middle may not agree with the all of the majority viewpoint.
R8dmarshall
The only way to show diferences in the actions of individual, and partys is comparison, but to do so in the mind set of retrabution is simply a continuation of the status quo of mean spiritidness in the halls of government and negative campaigning. The only successful way is by good example. Most people are aware of the damage to the electorial process and the blinding of real views on the stands and performancess of past and current representatives.
The laws of deflamation, slander, and fraud should specifically apply to political campaigns because an office won by lies, inuendo, and misrepreseintation should be a crime punishable in prison for the duration of the post won illegally.
We want representatives of integraty, not the best liers.
The first step toward a new form of government is disrespect within the halls of government. The next is the degradation of the constitution and bill of rights to consolidate power in the Exicutive Office.
R8dmarshall:
What are we taking our country back from? Is it from a political party? Is it from a mind set; or is it from an ideological path going in the wrong direction.
Both parties have in the present, or past acted as though they believed they were the only ones who had the best ideas, or knew what was best for the countfy. An ideology of us and them became manifest in doing what was best to keep them in power, but not what was actually best for the country and or world.
With the change in power from party to party it became as a pendulum that swung further from the left to the right with each changing of parties. A point has been reached that it has become so far right that there is no wrong, or so far left that there was no right. there was no right or wrong , only doing what it took to stay in power regardless what those positions were doing to the America we all love.
What we are taking our country back from is in reality the ideology of the us and thems. To do so we must change the mes to wes and that is U.S. as it should be. The enemy of getting back to the original ideals of the U.S. is the mean spirited us and them mind set within the halls of government and our schools.
Without mutual respect within the halls of our government, which spills over into our society, America will go the way of Rome and look like the most dangerous places in the world . They do not have a government of mutual cooperation as we, and look at what we could end up with!
<
But yet so much of the talk here is about putting one or another career politicians on the Unity08 ticket. Can we really expect career politicians to act as anything other than career politicians?
Hey I'd be all for people like Colin Powell, Hank Paulson, Bill Bradley, Pete Peterson, etc and other private sector types who have some sort of context for what they are getting in to and who meet the previous 2 criteria I mentioned. Lot's of non-politicos fit the bill.
R8dmarshall
BENEFITS OF FRONT WHEEL DRIVE VEHICLES”
“SAVINGS”
“ENERGY, POLLUTION, CONTROL, AND FISCAL”.
Based on the consideration that there is a thirty percent power loss at the trans axle on rear wheel drive vehicles it would be feasible to use front wheel drive vehicles as the primary design for passenger vehicles.
Energy savings should reflect the power savings on a front wheeled vehicle in cost of fuel, and decreased pollution in burning less fuel.
Vehicle control in front wheeled vehicles should be enhanced due to the powered wheels being under the engine.
With the powered wheels in rear wheel vehicles at the lighter end of the vehicle It would have more tendency to spin out with emergency stopping, or changes in power during turns.
Most in the general public are used to the rear wheeled drive and do not consider the advantages, or are not aware of them in front wheeled vehicles.
The front wheeled drive vehicles also decrease the dependency we have on foreign oil. If we are using less by changing the norm to front wheel powered vehicles It also would reflect on the dependency factor.
In heavy vehicle design the advantage would be lost due to the power needed and the size of the engine. It would not be possible to turn long diesels engines sidewise to the vehicle due to road width restrictions.
Power produced being the same, the use of front wheeled drive vehicles that do not loose power in a trans axle burns less fuel has better control, makes less pollution, costs less to run, and decreases our dependency on foreign oil.
David H. Marshall 07/14/07